How can I "allow" a lead to re-enter the same Engagement Program every x number of days?

[Ronn_Burner]

In a situation like the screenshot below where the goal is to enter a Canceled Client into an Engagement Program with 3 emails every 30 days until they convert or unsubscribe. If they do neither, I want to re-enter them to go through the same program again. And then again.

What is the best way to accomplish this - knowing that a lead can only be a member of a program in an engagement stream once.

Knowing Marketo essentially reads streams as:

Emails - have they received this email before (yes or no)

Programs - do they have a status in this program (yes or no)

How can I "allow" re-entry into a Program and/or what is the best way to do so?

I assume I need to clear Membership Status in some fashion - or maybe just clone the nested program (Program A) in the stream and simply put that one (Program B) after it so Marketo skips Program A and sends lead to Program B. Not sure that would work though as Re-entry into the Engagement Program stream would still need to happen.

This same Program Re-Entry will be utilized in other areas as well such as Upsell Programs so whatever the best way to structure this will be duplicated in other areas. It's essentially the infrastructure of a completely Dynamic Automation world from Lead entry through upselling. Only those that have unsubscribed will not be somewhere within this dynamic cycle.

Thanks!

[Jackie_Potts]

If they have not been through all of the content, you could pause them when they are passed to sales, then change status back to active when they "reenter" the engagement program. 

I don't think they can go back through the same content within the same engagement program.

[SanfordWhiteman]

I don't think this is a job for an EP anymore. It's too far off the intent of the feature. Build it using SCs instead, IMO.

[Ronn_Burner]

Interesting. Was expecting some Campaign is Requested trick type work around. Thank you for the response,Sanford Whiteman‌. It helps redirect me but can you please elaborate a bit more.

Like how many SC's do you foresee for this simple 3 email cycle every 30 days for anyone that has not converted or unsubscribed? Is the flow just utilizing the Send Email filters and Wait filters? As for the re-occurrence would you just set the Batch Campaign Schedule to allow the lead to go through the Flow once every 30 days? Any integral points you can offer would be greatly appreciated.

Sorry. I just want to get it right - in terms of best way to do it - as it will be a significant system utilized in multiple different areas.

[Jay_Jiang]

you could use either but smart campaigns is far easier

essentially you want to create a loop but smart campaigns can't request themselves, so the workaround is to have 2 smart campaigns request each other in a cycle (silly I know)

your program would have at minimum:

smart campaign A with

   trigger: i) campaign is requested

   flow: i) send email #1, ii) wait, iii) send email #2, iv) wait, v) send email #3, vi) wait, vii) request smart campaign B

smart campaign B with

   trigger: i) campaign is requested, ii) data value changes > lead status is "cancelled nurture"

   flow: i) request campaign > choice 1 request smart campaign A if lead status is "cancelled nurture"

smart campaign C with

   trigger: i) data value changes > lead status is not "cancelled nurture"

   flow: i) remove from flow is smart campaign A

[Ronn_Burner]

Thanks Jay! I have built this out as you laid out but I do have some clarifying questions.

1. Are these SC's sub-assets underneath a Default program (I assume) since it's not an EP?

2. Does this Campaign is Requested method in and of itself solve for the fact that "a lead can only go through a program one time"? Because it seems that re-entry problem would still exist - unless of course this method "tricks" Marketo.

3. How would you solve for the enter program 30 Days after Data Value Changes to 'Canceled' (New Cancels)? Would/Could/Should I simply add a WAIT > 30 Days at the top of the Campaign B Flow? Would you utilize the existing Custom Field (Nurture Start Date) I have currently being written to via a SC every time an Account Status becomes 'Canceled' it populates the Canceled Date field at that time and the Nurture Start Date at {+ 30 Days} from that time.

4. By "Canceled Nurture" are you referring to the lead's membership status within the program or the actual field that has their Account Status Data Value Changes when they Cancel, Subscribe, Free trial, etc?

As always - Thanks, Jay!

[Jay_Jiang]

1. Are these SC's sub-assets underneath a Default program (I assume) since it's not an EP?

It doesn't really matter if an EP houses the smart campaigns because it's the smart campaigns that will be sending emails not the EP, but to avoid confusion, use a default program to house the smart campaigns

2. Does this Campaign is Requested method in and of itself solve for the fact that "a lead can only go through a program one time"? 

EPs are the exception to the norm because they have preset rules. Smart campaigns follow the cadence set in the schedule tab, as long as you've allowed leads to run through every time, a lead can go through the flow again and again

3. How would you solve for the enter program 30 Days after Data Value Changes to 'Canceled' (New Cancels)? 

In your other post, my suggestion was to create a batch campaign with the filter:

In the flow of this campaign, use request campaign "Smart Campaign B" to add leads to the loop

Remove the 2nd trigger in "Smart Campaign B" of ii) data value changes > lead status is "cancelled nurture"

n.b. you can use a static list and Add to List triggers in place of request campaign for better smart campaign performance

4. By "Canceled Nurture" are you referring to the lead's membership status within the program or the actual field that has their Account Status Data Value Changes when they Cancel, Subscribe, Free trial, etc?

I was referring to the actual field. This is up to you, think through what makes sense to remove people from the smart campaign flow - I thought that if their lead status is no longer "cancelled account" they ought to be removed from the flow

[Ronn_Burner]

Thank you kindly, Jay! As to questions 1, 2 and 4 I'm with you. Just wanted to be sure.

Can you clear up a couple things regarding #3 please:

In your other post, my suggestion was to create a batch campaign with the filter:

I did do that and it is currently functioning as an entry into that EP program. I have already activated that Re-Engagement Campaign but due to the inability to "re-enter an EP" I realized I needed to do it differently - which is exactly this conversation. I will shut off that other EP within the next 30 days and activate this new Program we're talking about here.

In the flow of this campaign, use request campaign "Smart Campaign B" to add leads to the loop

By "this" campaign are you referring to that 'Start Nurture Date' Campaign I previously built and to add Request Campaign > Campaign B to it - making a Campaign D(4)? I believe this is what you meant by that.

n.b. you can use a static list and Add to List triggers in place of request campaign for better smart campaign performance

Sorry. This confused me.

Are you saying to use Added to List triggers in the Smart List in place of Campaign is Requested in Campaign A and Campaign B? In conjunction with replacing Request Campaign with Add to List in the flow of Campaign A, Campaign B and Campaign 4? Do I even need Campaign 4 or can I add 'Nurture Start Date' field to Campaign B? I guess I can only do that by using as a batch rather than a trigger and using 'Was Added to List' > in past 1 day.

Campaign A - (Deploys Re-Engagement Emails)

   T = Campaign is Requested or Added to List (Canceled)

   F = i) send email #1, ii) wait, iii) send email #2, iv) wait, v) send email #3, vi) wait, vii) 'Request Campaign B' or Add to             List (Canceled)

Campaign B - (Adds Canceled Leads to Loop)

   T = i) Campaign is Requested and ii) data value changes > lead status is "cancelled nurture"
         or Added to List (Canceled)

   F = i) request campaign > choice 1 request smart campaign A if lead status is "cancelled nurture" or Add to List          (Canceled)

Campaign C - (Removes from Flow)

  T = i) data value changes > lead status is not "cancelled nurture"

   F = i) remove from flow is smart campaign A

Campaign 4 - ('Nurture Start Date' in the past 1 Day)

   T = Nurture Start Date > in past 1 Day

   F = Request 'Campaign B' or Add to List

Please let me know where I'm completely off course here. I feel like I'm 95% there but if I'm way off the rails I will not be offended if you angrily insult me. Now that I think about it I must need a remove from list somewhere. Please and thank you! You are gentleman and a scholar, good sir. It is greatly appreciated.

[Jay_Jiang · Accepted solution]

I did do that and it is currently functioning as an entry into that EP program. I have already activated that Re-Engagement Campaign but due to the inability to "re-enter an EP" I realized I needed to do it differently - which is exactly this conversation. I will shut off that other EP within the next 30 days and activate this new Program we're talking about here.

Ok. I made a wrong assumption and thought your two programs were the same. 

By "this" campaign are you referring to that 'Start Nurture Date' Campaign I previously built and to add Request Campaign > Campaign B to it - making a Campaign D(4)? I believe this is what you meant by that.

You're right in your assumption. But, to add leads into the loop while maintaining the 30 day wait, add both of the batch campaigns from your old program and use them in this new program so you have a total of 5 smart campaigns.

To summarise:

Batch #1: date stamps Account Cancelled Date and calculates the nurture start date

Batch #2: on nurture start date, adds to loop by requesting Smart Campaign B

Smart Campaign B: "looper" that requests Smart Campaign A

Smart Campaign A: "sender" with Send Email and wait sequence with last step to request Smart Campaign B

Smart Campaign C: "remover" trigger campaign that listens for when a lead should be removed from flow of Smart Campaign A

Campaign B - (Adds Canceled Leads to Loop)

   T = i) Campaign is Requested and ii) data value changes > lead status is "cancelled nurture"
         or Added to List (Canceled)

   F = i) request campaign > choice 1 request smart campaign A if lead status is "cancelled nurture" or Add to List          (Canceled)

Don't use the data value changes trigger here otherwise you won't have the 30 day delay

Are you saying to use Added to List triggers in the Smart List in place of Campaign is Requested in Campaign A and Campaign B? In conjunction with replacing Request Campaign with Add to List in the flow of Campaign A, Campaign B and Campaign 4

Yes, you can use "Added to List" trigger to replace "Campaign is Requested" trigger and use "Add to List" flow step to replace "Request Campaign" flow step.

To summarise:

Batch #1: date stamps Account Cancelled Date and calculates the nurture start date

Batch #2: on nurture start date, add to list "nurture list"

Smart Campaign B: "looper" that requests Smart Campaign A  this is no longer needed

Smart Campaign A: trigger: Added to List is "nurture List" | flow: Send Email and wait sequence with last step Add to List "nurture list" (which is another way of creating a loop)

Smart Campaign C: "remover" trigger campaign that listens for when a lead should be removed from flow of Smart Campaign A and (optionally) removed from list "nurture list"

[Ronn_Burner]

Thank you, Jay! I truly appreciate the time and energy you have put into helping me with this - as well as other issues in the past. I love discovering new Marketo processes and learning and thoroughly understanding this particular "Loop" technique is a big deal to me as I will be utilizing it in many other situations. So huge thanks to you.

I'll use the Add to List version over the Campaign Request version based on your comment stating it results in better Smart Campaign performance - which I don't even know what that means. Haha! It either works or it doesn't in my mind but I'll take your word for it. Thanks again, Jay!