Geolocation information at open

[Robb_Barrett]

You know, when the weather is REALLY bad in Chicago, the last thing I'm thinking about is wanting to travel. All I'm seeing on TV is "Flights cancelled, people sleeping in O'Hare, people who booked cruises SOL."

I honestly can't imagine anything I'd rather be doing than travelling. Being stuck at an airport, waiting for my flight to cancel, hoping I can find a hotel room to accommodate me...

[SanfordWhiteman]

While I'm not sure how it's done, I'm fairly sure that Movable Inc said that they could do it based upon the location at time of open. This seems like it would be contingent on privacy laws, location services on, etc etc...but now I'm not sure.

Phillip, location (wifi + GPS-assisted) can only be queried via JS.

So, even when viewed via webmail on a domain for which Location-Aware Browsing (or equivalent, that's the Firefox term) has been enabled by the end user, it's not possible for an individual email to send your device location. (The webmail app itself could query your location, o' course, but that is off-topic.)

So these services need to use IP-based geolocation, which is notoriously imprecise (not to say useless) due to database churn, proxies, and VPNs.

[Phillip_Wild]

Super helpful. Thanks guys!

[Robb_Barrett]

Likewise, because I typically use a VPN or secure service which routes me through WI, CT or CA whenever I use an auto-location service that's web based it's never right.  It's actually more work than the expected time savings, and it's been that way at several companies I work with that have off-site servers.

[SanfordWhiteman]

It definitely defeats the concept of seeing if someone's on vacation if their source IP is the same datacenter all the time!

[Robb_Barrett]

PHIL -

Poking around, I found a service that does IP lookups based on header information in the email:Free Email Header Tracer | IP2Location

To test this, I used an email I received from Marketo.

Putting the headers in, here's how it routed:

Sender

IP Address	10.160.25.53
Location	Unknown
Latitude, Longitude	0, 0
Connection through	Private IP Address LAN
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 02:39 PM (UTC -)
Net Speed	-
Area Code	-
IDD Code	-
ZIP Code	-
Weather Station	-
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	0m
Usage Type	(RSV) Reserved

IP Address	204.93.64.13
Location	United States, California, Palo Alto
Latitude, Longitude	37.443254, -122.149828 (37°26'36"W   -122°8'59"N)
Connection through	Jive Software Inc.
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 10:39 PM (UTC -08:00)
Net Speed	DSL
Area Code	650
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	94301
Weather Station	Palo Alto (USCA0830)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	8m
Usage Type	(COM) Commercial

IP Address	167.89.36.126
Location	United States, Colorado, Denver
Latitude, Longitude	39.749838, -104.995597 (39°44'59"W   -104°59'44"N)
Connection through	Sendgrid Inc.
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 09:39 PM (UTC -07:00)
Net Speed	T1
Area Code	303/720
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	80202
Weather Station	Denver (USCO0105)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	1608m
Usage Type	(DCH) Data Center/Web Hosting/Transit

IP Address	8.16.0.17
Location	United States, California, Los Angeles
Latitude, Longitude	34.05223, -118.24368 (34°3'8"W   -118°14'37"N)
Connection through	Level 3 Communications Inc.
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 10:39 PM (UTC -08:00)
Net Speed	T1
Area Code	213/310/424/323
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	90001
Weather Station	Los Angeles (USCA0638)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	88m
Usage Type	(DCH) Data Center/Web Hosting/Transit

IP Address	127.0.0.1
Location	Unknown
Latitude, Longitude	0, 0
Connection through	Loopback
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 02:39 PM (UTC -)
Net Speed	-
Area Code	-
IDD Code	-
ZIP Code	-
Weather Station	-
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	0m
Usage Type	(RSV) Reserved

IP Address	67.231.149.43
Location	United States, California, Sunnyvale
Latitude, Longitude	37.401247, -122.007521 (37°24'4"W   -122°0'27"N)
Connection through	Proofpoint Inc.
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 10:39 PM (UTC -08:00)
Net Speed	T1
Area Code	408/650
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	94089
Weather Station	Sunnyvale (USCA1116)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	38m
Usage Type	(DCH) Data Center/Web Hosting/Transit

IP Address	3.159.19.234
Location	United States, Connecticut, Fairfield
Latitude, Longitude	41.21835, -73.25173 (41°13'6"W   -73°15'6"N)
Connection through	General Electric Company
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 07:39 PM (UTC -05:00)
Net Speed	COMP
Area Code	203
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	06828
Weather Station	Fairfield (USCT0073)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	8m
Usage Type	(COM) Commercial

IP Address	3.159.146.22
Location	United States, Connecticut, Fairfield
Latitude, Longitude	41.21835, -73.25173 (41°13'6"W   -73°15'6"N)
Connection through	General Electric Company
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 07:39 PM (UTC -05:00)
Net Speed	COMP
Area Code	203
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	06828
Weather Station	Fairfield (USCT0073)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	8m
Usage Type	(COM) Commercial

IP Address	3.159.19.133
Location	United States, Connecticut, Fairfield
Latitude, Longitude	41.21835, -73.25173 (41°13'6"W   -73°15'6"N)
Connection through	General Electric Company
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 07:39 PM (UTC -05:00)
Net Speed	COMP
Area Code	203
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	06828
Weather Station	Fairfield (USCT0073)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	8m
Usage Type	(COM) Commercial

IP Address	3.159.19.197
Location	United States, Connecticut, Fairfield
Latitude, Longitude	41.21835, -73.25173 (41°13'6"W   -73°15'6"N)
Connection through	General Electric Company
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 07:39 PM (UTC -05:00)
Net Speed	COMP
Area Code	203
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	06828
Weather Station	Fairfield (USCT0073)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	8m
Usage Type	(COM) Commercial

IP Address	174.36.92.96
Location	United States, Texas, Dallas
Latitude, Longitude	32.93949, -96.83873 (32°56'22"W   -96°50'19"N)
Connection through	SoftLayer Technologies Inc.
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 08:39 PM (UTC -06:00)
Net Speed	T1
Area Code	214/469/972
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	75244
Weather Station	Dallas (USTX0327)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	128m
Usage Type	(DCH) Data Center/Web Hosting/Transit

IP Address	174.36.80.208
Location	United States, Texas, Dallas
Latitude, Longitude	32.93949, -96.83873 (32°56'22"W   -96°50'19"N)
Connection through	SoftLayer Technologies Inc.
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 08:39 PM (UTC -06:00)
Net Speed	T1
Area Code	214/469/972
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	75244
Weather Station	Dallas (USTX0327)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	128m
Usage Type	(DCH) Data Center/Web Hosting/Transit

IP Address	67.228.50.32
Location	United States, Texas, Dallas
Latitude, Longitude	32.93949, -96.83873 (32°56'22"W   -96°50'19"N)
Connection through	SoftLayer Technologies Inc.
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 08:39 PM (UTC -06:00)
Net Speed	T1
Area Code	214/469/972
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	75244
Weather Station	Dallas (USTX0327)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	128m
Usage Type	(DCH) Data Center/Web Hosting/Transit

IP Address	75.126.253.0
Location	United States, Texas, Dallas
Latitude, Longitude	32.93949, -96.83873 (32°56'22"W   -96°50'19"N)
Connection through	Joe Scharf
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 08:39 PM (UTC -06:00)
Net Speed	T1
Area Code	214/469/972
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	75244
Weather Station	Dallas (USTX0327)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	128m
Usage Type	(DCH) Data Center/Web Hosting/Transit

IP Address	75.126.200.128
Location	United States, Texas, Dallas
Latitude, Longitude	32.93949, -96.83873 (32°56'22"W   -96°50'19"N)
Connection through	SoftLayer Technologies Inc.
Local Time	01 Dec, 2016 08:39 PM (UTC -06:00)
Net Speed	T1
Area Code	214/469/972
IDD Code	1
ZIP Code	75244
Weather Station	Dallas (USTX0327)
Mobile Country Code (MCC)	-
Mobile Network Code (MNC)	-
Carrier Name	-
Elevation	128m
Usage Type	(DCH) Data Center/Web Hosting/Transit

You

    Here's the thing: I live outside Chicago, IL. The last place the email header shows for me is in Dallas Texas' weather station. As you can assume, my friends in Dallas are enjoying much better weather than I am in Chicago. This is due to the content and sender of the email - we route all external email through a service that checks the links and then re-sends a new version of the email to us that's been sanitized.  Even when I send a link directly from Marketo, our service (ProofPoint) first reads the emails, recodes the links so that it first goes to their service which pre-checks the links prior to allowing me to visit the site. It also re-writes the Subject line with EXT: to show me that it came from outside the company.

I tried another email - a P2P sent from one of my Co-workers in Vermont and this has a last connection of Fairfield, CT which is where GE's headquarters are located.

Now, there might be a better way to more accurately pin-point a person but it'd most likely need to be browser based.  When you do a search for "Location aware" you typically get sender-side location services or how to be location aware using an app, which as I expected is the best, most accurate method.

The next question I'd have is how it would work for offline emails?  What if I'm on a plane already?  Your email wouldn't work very well.  What if I'm travelling in a car or train?  I'll be passing through numerous.  What if I'm on a boat? (Queue Lonely Island.)

[Phillip_Wild]

Haha! Yes, I can see how this breaks down very quickly. I might have some tough questions for a vendor or two next time they try to sell me on this!

The idea of requesting zipcode information from our subscribers, so we have something a bit more robust, seems like the way to go. If we determine the reward is worth the effort!

Thanks again.

[SanfordWhiteman]

I wouldn't give up on it completely (save for the note above that even when it works with absolute precision, it's still only customizing the image and not the text).

But you should set a threshold for usability (if it works for x% of leads and has a y% effect on conversions) and have a graceful fallback or some kind of friendly disclaimer ("Local offers are approximate. Tell us your zipcode(s) to get the perfect content.").

[SanfordWhiteman]

But the trail of Received: headers has nothing to do with the IP address that fetches the images in the email.

That source  IP on the HTTP side may be an anonymizing proxy at a central site, to be sure, and so conceals the end-user's location -- even if that location is further hidden behind a VPN concentrator anyway -- but it's a different traffic path.

Note a *non-anonymizing* proxy isn't a problem as it will pass IP of earlier hops.

[SanfordWhiteman]

FWIW just tested and Outlook.com, Yahoo! Mail, and standard Outlook/OWA don't anonymize, while Gmail does. This doesn't represent the full spectrum of corporate email protection, but it gives an initial lay of the land.